Responses to Questions on
Unificationism on the Internet - Volume 40
Nov 17, 1996
On Sun, 17 Nov 1996, Pacificus wrote:
> Pacificus:
> |> Tell us of the scriptures that affirm that those who
> |> follow the path of no-path are also following the way of truth.
>
> >Sorry, I don't think I can do that. What is the path
> >of no-path? Is that not the path of ignorance and being lost?
>
> No, it is not. It is the path across a field that has been renewed of
> its previous paths, if you so wish it to be, so that you can find your
> own path. The field is the same regardless; we are each presented with
> it. You choose a path that has been used and written of by others.
> Others choose otherwise.
>
> Or it is the way of Zen, if that pleases you.
Okay, now I understand you better. The way of Zen certainly appears to
be the way of paradox, yet much truth is rightfully expressed in paradox.
We see that in Jesus' teaching: "The one who seeks to gain his life will
lose it, the one who would give up his life for my sake will find it."
> |> Tell us of the scriptures that affirm that those whose
> |> scripture is the universe are also following the way of truth.
>
> >Those who follow the way of the animals and the plants and the trees
> >and mountains are better off than those who do harm to their fellow
> >creatures. But man is called to a higher path than that of nature. God
> >send his sunlight and rain on the just and the unjust. That is a way of
> >learning unconditional love from nature.
>
> Well, there is hope in your answer. You seem to define the universe as
> nature. There is more (or less!). It is, after all, the universe that is
> presented to you, that is the universe. As one example, the universe
> includes everything in the scriptures you refer to.
I suppose the universe is all in the creation that is not God, the cosmos
in other words. There are two worlds, the spiritual world and the physical
world, with man at the center, and God intended to be at the center of
man. However, in this fallen world, humans are far from God and the two
worlds are divided. For this reason, people are unaware of the presence
of the spiritual world, and are unable to perceive it.
> |> Those are the scriptures that are worthy of our attention.
>
> Damian, you have been so kind as to reach out to those that follow a set of
> 'agreed to be acceptable' scriptures. That is magnaminous. Please extend your
> invitation further, or you will be setting up a chosen people.
>
> Pacificus
The ultimate scripture which is closest to the heart of every man, woman
and child, closer than the Bible, the Koran, the Torah, the Baghavad
Gita, or any other teacher or teaching, is the HUMAN CONSCIENCE. That
way is open to everyone, without exception. I am a firm believer in the
conscience. Indeed, God's work of restoring fallen people to the state
of primordial grace and beyond to the Kingdom of God, Nirvana, the
Messianic Age, is only possible because of the conscience. It is our
ultimate true friend.
Sincerely,
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on alt.religion.unification.
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Nov 17, 1996
Subject: Re: DP: The Second Advent will occur by his birth on the Earth
Newsgroups: alt.religion.unification,talk.religion.misc,alt.religion.christian,alt.christnet.theology
References: <565482$7c@krypto.zippo.com> <19961111033900.WAA20618@ladder01.news.aol.com> <567htn$r53@krypto.zippo.com>
Organization: Sent via CAIS Internet
Distribution:
On Mon, 11 Nov 1996 18:44:29 GMT piedtech (piedtech@intrlink.com) wrote:
> Poor Gunnard , It is obvious that you do not know how to read with out
> someone telling you what it means . Here is a clear cut case of
> mr.moon taking somthing out of context .
[snip]
> Gunnard I will let you in on a little secret that your folks in
> charge don't want you talking with me as I am a real life Minister of
> the gospel who has been to seminary and has the ability to question
> them on a level that would make them question their faith . Go to them
> and tell them that you are having this discussion with me I will bet
> they will tell you to not correspond with me and may even tell you to
> stop surfing the net because you are not strong enough etc etc
> jim
Jim,
Your post drips with arrogance and conceit. For your information, I have
a seminary degree and have studied the scriptures at length and no church
nanny tells me what I can and cannot read.
Remember the Pharisees who would go to the ends of the earth to make a
proselyte and then make him twice as fit for hell as they themselves
were. (Matt 23:15). Beware, you are becoming like them.
Sadly,
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on alt.religion.unification.
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Nov 18, 1996
Subject: Re: Jesus = God
Newsgroups: alt.religion.unification,talk.religion.misc,alt.religion.christian,alt.christnet.theology
References: <01bbd26d$1ff46840$2a10b6cc@marzioli>
Organization: Sent via CAIS Internet
Distribution:
On 14 Nov 1996 21:27:47 GMT Marzioli (marzioli@tdl.com) wrote:
> I challenge anyone who can to come here and posts the context of "Jesus is
> God". These verses in the Bible are many and numerous. Now from this I
> will post the verses again, and you can tell me why it is not so, as I see
> it. thank you for your time :)
> Luke 22:69-70 "But from now on the Son of Man will be seated at the right
> hand of the power of God." And they all said, "are you the son of God,
> then? And he said to them "Yes I am."
It says Jesus is the Son of God.
> John 10:30 "I and the Father are one."
This can be viewed in at least two ways.
(1) They are identically one, interchangeable, indistinguishable,
congruent, one and the same. Tradition Christian
doctrine teaches that there are three distinct persons
in the Trinity, so they are not one in this sense.
(2) One could say that God and Jesus are one as a husband and wife
are one, or as mind and body are one. They are
united, yet distinct. This is a more reasonable way
to look at it, and this is the Unification view.
> John 10:37-38 "If I do not do the works of the My father, do not believe
> Me; But if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works,
> that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the
> Father."
God's nature is manifested in Jesus. Likewise, every man is a manifestation
of his parents. Jesus is God's son, but is not God Himself. Also, whoever
believes in him, he give the power to become sons of God. (Jn 1:12)
> John 12:45 "And he who beholds Me beholds the One who sent Me."
Same as above.
> John 14:7-10 "If you had known me, you would have known My Father also;
> from now on you know Him, and have seen Him. "Philip said to Him, "Lord,
> show us the Father and it is enough for us." Jesus said to him, "Have I
> been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me Philip? he who
> has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say, 'show us the Father'? Do
> you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The
> words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father
> abiding in Me does His words."
Same as above.
> John 1:1-3 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and
> the Word was God. he was in the beginning with God. All things came into
> being by Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into
> being."
God's ideal was in God's mind from the beginning, and Jesus was the
first man to embody God's ideal for a man. All that was created was
based on His ideal, His Word. God is revealed to us through Jesus.
> John 1:14 "And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His
> glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and
> truth."
Same as above.
> Collosians 2:9 "For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form"
Same as above.
> 1 Timothy 3:16 "And by common confession great is the mystery of godliness;
> He who was reveled in flesh, was vindicated in the Spirit, beheld by
> angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in
> glory"
Same as above.
> Hebrews 1:3 "And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact
> representation of Hi s nature, and upholds all things by the word of His
> power. When He had made purification of sins, he sat down at the right
> hand of the Majesty on high;"
Jesus, by virtue of his sinless Godly nature, was authorized by God to
figuve sins.
> John 8:58 "Jesus said to them "truly, truly I say to you, before Abraham
> was born, I am."
Jesus came as the new ancestor for all humanity, so that everyone, even
Abraham, must be reborn through Jesus and his bride.
> Samuel Marzioli
> for more information on the Unification Church go to
> > http://www.unification.net
> and my web page addressing the Unification church at
> http://www.tdl.com/~marzioli/unificat.htm
Hey, I like this, guy, giving references to both sides! :-)
Sincerely,
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on alt.religion.unification.
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Nov 18, 1996
Subject: Re: LOGOS
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc, alt.bible.prophecy, alt.christnet,
alt.christnet.bible, alt.christnet.philosophy, alt.religion.unification,
alt.christnet.theology, alt.religion.christian,
alt.religion.christian.calvary-chapel
References:
<190bklj60.alamito@zero-one.co.nz> <326CBD3D.7D8D@execpc.com>
<327892e7.130689@news.compuserve.com> <327A2DC9.1B12@primenet.com>
<55e4lb$avc@dfw-ixnews9.ix.netcom.com> <327B61A0.5CB5@execpc.com>
<55vfg7$5rv@job.acay.com.au> <560jid$kv2@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>
<328489E0.5CF4@epix.net> <3284DD0B.4D1C@force.stwing.upenn.edu>
<563n2r$dnb@dfw-ixnews10.ix.netcom.com>
On 10 Nov 1996 04:52:43 GMT Libertarius (attila1@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
> Only in the twisted minds of those who refuse to see beyond their
> bible. The point was obviously missed: Jesus was no unique incarnation
> of the Logos. EVERYTHING and EVERYONE is.
> Libertarius
This is true, that we are all incarnations of the LOGOS. But, we are
not complete incarnations of the logos as individuals, but only as a
couple, since the LOGOS is Yang and Yin, masculine and feminine, as well
as spiritual and physical. The complete image of the LOGOS has creative
and multiplicative power, only present in the united male and female.
What that means is that Jesus could only be a complete incarnation of
the Logos when he married. For that reason, the Bible on a couple of
occasions refers to the two anointed ones, as in Zech 4:14, or the two
witnesses referred to in Rev. 11:3. In Unification theology, this ideal
couple is referred to as the True Parents.
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on alt.religion.unification.
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Nov 19, 1996
On Tue, 19 Nov 1996, MEY wrote:
> If you accept that the quraan is true and in its PURE FORM as scholars
> and historians do, then you have
> no choice but to accept that this is the last revaltation because that is
> what it says about itself..
> Peace
Dear MEY,
I do not accept that ANY book contains all truth, but that each can be a
textbook teaching some part of that whole infinite cosmic truth. However,
I believe that the Quran is inspired by God and is a valuable source of
inspiration to guide people to God.
Allah Akhbar!
Sincerely,
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on alt.religion.unification.
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Nov 21, 1996
Subject: Re: YIN-YANG (WAS: Re: LOGOS)
Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc, alt.bible.prophecy, alt.christnet,
alt.christnet.bible, alt.christnet.philosophy, alt.religion.unification,
alt.christnet.theology, alt.religion.christian,
alt.religion.christian.calvary-chapel
References:
<190bklj60.alamito@zero-one.co.nz> <326CBD3D.7D8D@execpc.com>
<327892e7.130689@news.compuserve.com> <327A2DC9.1B12@primenet.com>
<55e4lb$avc@dfw-ixnews9.ix.netcom.com> <327B61A0.5CB5@execpc.com>
<55vfg7$5rv@job.acay.com.au> <560jid$kv2@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>
<328489E0.5CF4@epix.net> <3284DD0B.4D1C@force.stwing.upenn.edu>
<563n2r$dnb@dfw-ixnews10.ix.netcom.com> <56ou2n$ls@news2.cais.com>
<56q47d$nes@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com>
On 18 Nov 1996 16:51:57 GMT Libertarius (attila1@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
> >This is true, that we are all incarnations of the LOGOS. But, we are
> >not complete incarnations of the logos as individuals, but only as a
> >couple, since the LOGOS is Yang and Yin, masculine and feminine, as
> well
> >as spiritual and physical. The complete image of the LOGOS has
> creative
> >and multiplicative power, only present in the united male and female.
> >
> >What that means is that Jesus could only be a complete incarnation of
> >the Logos when he married. For that reason, the Bible on a couple of
> >occasions refers to the two anointed ones, as in Zech 4:14, or the two
> >witnesses referred to in Rev. 11:3. In Unification theology, this
> ideal
> >couple is referred to as the True Parents.
> That is a bunch of nonsense. For being the follower of a
> religion of Chinese-Korean descent, you don't seem to understand the
> Yin-Yang concept very well. Just look at the symbol of the Yin-Yang.
> You'll see a white dot in the black (actually red) field, and a black
> (should be red) dot in the white field. That means that Yin cannot
> exist without Yang, nor Yang without Yin. Translated into individual
> character, each INDIVIDUAL has BOTH characteristics. A male has some
> YIN, and a female some YANG characteristics. An individual is a whole
> being! Marriage is the union of two whole, sovereign inividuals, one
> male, one female. It absolutely DOES NOT mean the ridiculous doctrine
> that you must be married or coupled to be whole!
I did not say that Yang cannot exist without Yin or vise versa. It is
because the male has some Yin and the female has some Yang that there
is any commonality between the sexes so that they can relate to one
another at all. However, nobody can deny that only the union of male
and female can create life. So, it is the union of male and female that
fully resembles God who is the creator. No single individual can do
this. For you to suggest that this is a ridiculous notion is merely
defensiveness on your part.
Sincerely,
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on alt.religion.unification.
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Nov 22, 1996
On Mon, 18 Nov 1996, John & Joy Pople wrote:
> Damian remarked,
>
> >In the last three years, I have gone from being a rather
> >bland poor-to-average standard UC member to being a devoted evangelist
> >with a fire in my belly.
>
> I'd be interested in hearing how this transformation took place.
To make a long story short, I had a great deal of personal tragedy that
caused me to reassess everything in my life. My decision was to turn to
God, like a prodigal son, and in my suffering, I found Him to be my soul
mate. I came to see that Father is intimately conversant with God's
suffering life course, having endured a lot of tragedy himself. I also
realized that if I wanted to get myself right with God, then Father is the
one who knows better than anyone how to do that and has shown us the way.
So began a course of repentance, prayer with the family morning and
evening, and personal prayer at other times, cold shower EVERY morning
without fail, 5 am pledge ... if I have gone to bed, or pledge on going to
bed if I pull a late nighter like tonight, diligently reading Father's
words and the Divine Principle, a great deal of personal discipline in
short. So, my spirit began to change, since the Word is the foundation for
resurrection. After just 40 days of this, I began to have a great desire
to witness. So began my search for a way to witness that could reach a lot
of people.
You are seeing the fruits of three years of having changed course and
headed in that new direction. I hope that it will lead to even more
fruitful and rewarding things. As the family pledge number 6 says:
Our Family pledges to embody God and True Parents; we will
perfect a family which moves heavenly fortune and conveys Heaven's
blessing to our community, by centering on True Love.
I want to be a source of Blessing to the world, way beyond just the
Unification community.
ITPN,
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on alt.religion.unification.
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Nov 24, 1996
Subject: Re: Prove God's existence
Newsgroups: a.bsu.religion, alt.atheism, alt.bible.prophecy, alt.christnet,
alt.christnet.bible, alt.christnet.philosophy, alt.christnet.theology,
alt.religion.christian, alt.religion.unification, talk.atheism,
talk.origins, talk.religion.misc,
References: <4thocd$18g4@www.univie.ac.at>
<32014522.10995930@news.exis.net> <4u15bb$r71@hermes.louisville.edu>
<32077a38.6675141@news.exis.net>
<32234C02.72F
<32974E5E.7B5A@airmail.net>
On Sat, 23 Nov 1996 13:19:58 -0600 Capella (capella@airmail.net) wrote:
> Why would God (if he existed) give us logic and tell us not to use it?
Attempting to prove the existence of God by logic is like trying to
convince a blind man that the sky is blue when he refuses to believe
it. There is none so blind as he who does not want to see. Can you prove
the existence of love? Few of us feel the need to prove it. Why this
incessant call to prove God's existence? Is it not because those who
call for proof cannot let go of this question? If God does not exist,
why even talk about Him as though He exists?
We know of the existence of love because we see the manifestation of
its effects in those in whom love dwells. So also, we can know of the
existence of the invisible God by the manifestation of His presence in
the lives of those in whom He dwells. If those who claim to belong to
God are just as nasty and mean-spirited as the rest of the world, then
the atheist with some justification may say that God is dead.
So, the best proof of God's existence is in the lives of Godly men and
women. Atheism arose as a result of the failures and hypocrisy of
Christianity that failed to correct the injustices that arose at the
time of the spread of Christianity to the world level. The void that
dead Christianity left was filled with the bitter resentment of atheists,
materialists for whom God was a bitter hoax.
When Christianity can manifest in the world the love that it preaches,
then atheists will become believers. Until then, they will be on the
side of the Accuser.
Damian Anderson +1-301-921-0082 Home damian@unification.net
Unification Home Page http://www.unification.net
Web pages on Unificationist ideas and activities in 15 languages and growing.
See articles on news:alt.religion.unification.
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